Stephen Daniel Clarke - Global Executive Director at JLL (Ep. 60)

[Music] introduce yourself and say a little bit about who you are and what you do all right yeah that's right Steven Clark I usually go by Steven Daniel Clark my middle name is very very important to me and actually I've actually got two middle name Steven Daniel Michael Michael dadley uh live here in Dallas Texas uh have done for the past 14 years but as you hear I'm not a native of Texas grew up in South London um and spent most of my formative years there into my S Young adulthood before I moved here and my upbringing um lived in London grew up in London but grew up the Jamaican way because my family red some backgrounder steeped you know my mom was born in Jamaica grandparents from Jamaica my dad was born in London but um Jamaican parents and so by day in school it was classic British education guarantee you by the time we got home and on the weekends we you may have sort of been in you know downtown Kingston you know it was H we were yeah we're very colorful family what what do what what is classic uh London education School me that so if I pulled out one of my um two things how we dress if I pulled out one of my um school pictures you would have thought you like that's Hogwarts right that's that's like that's that's the first thing that came to my mind you I Blazer uniform with a badge on the Blazer which is kind of your pressed um and then aside from that like I went to an Anglican what you call Elementary School call it primary school and so um you know in the morning we had kind of what we call here like they call it home room here in the US it was like we'd have this kind of collective assembly and you would uh come together and be like some meditation a little kind of word of encouragement or something by the principal or the deputy principal and that would happen every day and then you would have your you know kind of your your classes the sports we play by the time you get to that middle and high school it's rugby you start you play football AKA soccer very early on and then you know s of baseball we have a game round the S you know Cricket all of those Sports you think about people really play that yeah we grew up to school doing all that of course we did track and basketball and things like that as well but it was that was you know that was the classic upbring you go lot in London it's public transportation mostly some people got a ride to school but um You' have a walk take a bus um yeah those red buses that you see on the movies you saw a couple things jump out and I don't believe we've ever spoken about this before um I went to a quaker school for elementary school so from kindergarten through fourth and it sounded pretty similar like not The Home Room but we would have meeting house where it was more of that meditation and you know silent reflection and you could stand up and say something and there was words of encouragement and one thing that jumps out to me that that amazes me actually is that I didn't realize how powerful that was until being an adult until I realized like how much that meant and how special that was and how I took it for granted but but at least I had the uh the experience to draw back on so I am very grateful for that you actually make a really good point like I can resonate the same experience um that kind of Silent reflection quiet slowed down like just slowing down your day very early in the day and they're getting us ready to go learn and they say do it early enough in the day and you think about how fast we move now like this these are some of the things I've had to incorporate into my adult like like very recently like it took me a minute like after you know burning out two or three times and you know we get through the pandemic and all the different vicisitudes of Life Family career but now just as you say appreciating the ability to just pause I do it sometimes I just walk away from here like I have a walk I do every day I just take some minute so I have to step away from the desk and walk walk around I get I get a moment or two to just like quiet myself down but yeah you're right I didn't appreciate it back then I just thought it was boring now I'm like and so did you another overlap here is that you played rug so I played after I played basketball in high school and a little bit in college I played rugby in college uh um and I don't think we talked about that before did you play for a long time growing up or was this just uh say my first equivalent my first three years of middles so um so current of like here be sixth grade through 8th so it the first time I played and then yeah I played like you know it was part of our physical education played other schools so I was like skinny you know skinny guy so I wasn't the guy trying to take a hit all the time I would played on the wings get me the ball out there and I'll just run yeah and hopefully not get like clapped out you did yeah so I kind I kind of jump back onto some things but I want to I want to go back into your childhood because I first of all before just tell the audience like what what do you currently do in your role I'd like to build up to that but i' like to also absolutely talk about what are you currently doing yes I've been work I work with Jones langal jll I have been based here in Dallas I work in a global role and what I do is I work for her glob CEO Lisa business as his head of innovation globally what that really entails is there's we are on a very extensive and Progressive digital transformation so how we use technology with both our clients investor clients occupy clients and our Brokers like you know so as you know that the industry for decades it's kind of incrementally evolved into Tech but now you know what has been very disaggregated terms of data business process analog is now you know we have to be much more Progressive in terms of technology so I help you know work provide sh lot of Technology Partners around building our road maps where do we need to put investment some of that where we build some of that will we buy and then the big piece how do we drive adoption um which is not easy in this industry so that's that's one big pillar of my role and the other is know do a bit m&a which could announce we did a really good one recently we're about to close and you guys probably read about that with Rays was really good where I was involved in that and then the other piece is just we're always trying to evolve our business models so like restructuring where should we go where are our growth markets both here and overseas um what does that look like how do we mobilize our teams around that so helping shape that working with our Business Leaders to partner with but we can jump into more of that but it's quite quite Dynamic really interesting and I and we can get into this I haven't been a career a commercial real estate life um kind of came into this almost past my midcareer points it's been really interesting jumping into an industry that's very well culture and structures and coming into that as an outsider and that's that's one of the things that I I'm excited about getting there and that's why I've been very excited about to have this to have this conversation but growing up like what when you were in middle school high school like what did you see as your career like what did you Aspire was there anything that you were like I want to be in business I want to be in finance like what were your goals yeah my goals interesting I I had a s this I had a goal to be in business but didn't know where at that point in time so like during the 80s early '90s we were just starting to get into things like coding at school you know we we had computers in school they weren't laptops and like there was this computer room I used to really enjoy going in there and doing some of that so technology was a piece I wasn't sure what I wanted to do in that in that realm but I I'll jump to this one of the things I now know looking back is I was always that guy put a project together whether that was a group assignment whether that something I was working on for myself something we were doing in class so there was I knew somewhere in then people who were older than me and like mentors would tell me hey you've got a leadership gift um and I would get nominated for programs and extra responsibilities and things like that so I knew there was going to be this Fusion of sort of business and Leadership and actually I told myself I wanted to go into law because I just you know back then he like Dr lawyer and I was like hey they make a lot of money but I there I just knew it was going to be in the realm of business projects but but I didn't know where I was going to land you know so what I tried to do is my dad helped me with this he because look pick a broad range of subject s of s picking subjects in high school yeah she had me take two languages I what I have to do two everyone else is doing one he's like no do French and German at that time the EU kind of you know becoming more prevalent and they go into The single currency and that will just get just brought he did he just did a great job at broaded in my world my world view my mom did as well travel a lot go across different parts of Europe as well as going back back home to Jamaica so that opened up my appe so I actually believed could do anything so I for me and I've now realized this it was less about the role and what type of work experience I wanted I wanted it to be somewhere I could see the World Travel lead create new things and I'm now starting to see some of that manifest um just in different ways as I look back and so was this in University or you call University like in the College Years that you were starting to to to really think about these things yes it was and candidly I um started University and started on a lord degree and one semester into that um to my parents this like pain quit I was like oh my like this is not it it was just I had some other things going on personally and I was like started this LW degree and I was like oh my goodness this is horrible um it was it was the reading it was the the approach and I just thought I just told myself this is what I wanted to do and it was so far away from where I really wanted to be thankfully after some time I said well my dad said yeah you're not going to sit around the house and do nothing I went out and got a job and I started working in the travel industry ended up at a company um that was owned by what was tww at the time um it UK based were owned by tww tww got acquired by American and then I ended up working with this this this tour operator owned Byer coent of American Airlines vacations UK and OB just did sales what happened there was um the managing director and the person I reported to ran reservations same career curring St like there's more in you than this you're going to have to go back to University until you do until you reenroll we're just going to stretch you here on the job so they exposed and got me traveling into the US and different things like that they gave you extra assignments and those types of things um and in eventually I went back and did a business degree my bachelor's in business and then I took her like couldn't hear what you call a major I majored in business information systems and was that when you saw business and business information was it becoming more clear on what type of business that you wanted to do was there anything that stood out to you that like yeah hey this is wow yeah this this is the path that I want to take at the time he was Banking and the reason I say that technology in banking two couple of things heavy influenced on my dad who worked for one of the large UK Banks um in the corporate industry um he was in technology but he was doing like project management program management type roles and so by virtue of that I got to do at least I got to do work experience did a summer internship for a few months so that and then then we were building up to the year y 2K so I got a lot of I like okay there's going to be a lot of work kind of s problems to solve and so I kind of start to narrow in on like I think I want to go into the banking industry um it was a solid industry at the time it still is right um and then I thought that'd be a good place for me to cut my teeth and that's where I ended up starting out after the university I joined a a program which took it was a cohort program graduate um you know thousands of applicants and I was I was shocked I kind of made it through to the final round and I remember I didn't I actually didn't tell my parents anything i' made this to the final round it was like it's two day interview process offsite and um I got offered the job and um told my parents and I was like and that I knew I knew when I got to that that this assessment day type of problems they were asking us to solve I'm like yeah this it was right up my alley in terms of that some of that problem solving project strategy they were trying to get from here to there and so that was yeah it start to get much clearer and so how long were you in that role like so how long between that and going into commercial real estate yeah so there at least probably 18 years so like what happed okay wow I didn't realize it was that long yeah so this progression um did worked in the bank you know I joined them as a as a coder initially was coding on this old banking platform match black screen green green fun and you know test testing on this old you know kind of European common payment system and then they rotated us I did a rotation at project management and then um accenta came in to restructure the whole it department and I got put on some of these special transformation projects um working with both Accenture and Folks at the bank and that what happened during that period of time the bank sponsored do it me doing a postgraduate diploma in management which is about 2third of an MBA and um through that one the professor said have you considered consulting which I hadn't just transpired about 18 months later so I've been with the bank about four years and um got some Outreach from IBM and um in that work you know they were looking for people who had industry experience who they could bring in as consultants to work like large projects that they were doing for various Banks and so um that's why I got kind of my problem solving strategic planning and change management cut my teeth there um you know 0708 Leman Brothers happens to the banking project start to dry up and I end up going to join a firm called cognizant who who I knew as like they just did it Outsourcing and I didn't want to do that but they had a small group was strategic consulting which they were building an office out of London kind of go across Europe it was actually a gentleman for who was American guy from Harvard Business School and um we we H it off and interviewed of them and I joined them and it was in that period of time that I kind of expanded experience set Beyond banking industry and I just started Consulting across various different Industries and start doing a lot of m&a post m&a integration work and that got me out to fulfill a dream that that first gig I was traveling to Asia I was in the US like twice a month for like a seven eight month period kind of brought us up to around 20 early 2010 when there like hey you want to move to the US and I was like absolutely so I was like yep going to the big apple and um the the executive who um was over our Global division was actually based here in the Dallas Fort Worth Texas area and he was like why don't you come to Dallas for a year and after that you know you can go wherever you want and I was like okay I'll do it for a year and um and the year has been 14 because and so did that work to Delight for a while and you know so at that point I was like okay I want to become a Consulting partner I just saw the track saw the pathway or with a young family at the time um that the road warrior like you're gone every week mon to Thursday sometimes Monday to Friday and I had to make a life decision around I going to need to Pivot wasn't sure how I love doing this type of work I can't be on the road every day um like this is what we were working virtually like you get out to the client and you're there you know for four or five days a week and I was fortunate and blessed enough that you know through Network pepsic Co reached out and I worked with them uh for about two and a half years kind of doing similar work that I was doing for client in-house so there was a lot of restructuring transformation Outsourcing and things like that um followed a mentor to messen and then that brought you know spent a little bit of time there a couple of things on my own for about a year while I figure out what I wanted to do and then jll we're about to acquire HFF and again we'll talk about Connections and you know as we talk about this it was actually the person who hiring me pepsic code was at jlll just got to jll we you know we exchange L like hey I'm in the market for something she introduced me to a peer who said hey we're about to make an acquisition here he you're good at this and know we talked about six seven weeks and then they brought me on here at J up to help with the c the acquisition you know the post merger uh work to be done with HFF and they were their you know their leaderships P out Dallas and that started the you know last kind of almost six-year Journey here at jll which has been you know we talk about been very decorated in terms of things I've been able to do were were there any as you as you were maneuvering through your career and going to these different was there are there any themes that you can point to are like this is what I learned from these opportunities and what I I took from this place and brought to other that have made that have you know been a theme but been consistent like this travels this way of thinking this way of being is useful in every situation is there anything that comes out to you yeah start with the first one um so getting a bit clear on like my I'm going to use this term calling or what my thing is which it was this is very recent as I've looked back and so when you're good at a lot of different things and you could you know you could throw me at most types of business problems and I could I could figure out or I could assemble a team that can go after it started you know people said he does you know he's the strategy guy but it's a bit more than that because I do execution as well and I'm mobilize and so for me um often time the pain Point either happens internally or client is being able to quickly deser what's the pain point and there's use your sense of urgency around it or use your sense of like this feels bit more Dynamic and less cooky cut than we've done before and I think a thing that's been a common them for me partly gift and I've tried to work on it as well is being able to quickly discern that bring others into the problem and then start to let Solutions emerge pretty quickly and usually I what I translate that to is the stakeholders ask is like saying this is a problem I want to get unstuck and actually I want to Sprint like I don't want this to be a slow burn so my thing is like how do I catalyze something quickly and strategically so that's one thing building connections has been a big theme U my late grandfather when we were growing up in the UK he's from Jamaica so he came over to the UK at post World War II so it wasn't very diverse and so um you know he went through he that whole generation they called them the wind Rush generation that was the ship they came over from the from the caribbian on um just encountered a number of different things on what he didn't want his grandchildren to be faced with you know it's like there's a lot of opposition out there his whole thing was like live well with everybody build connections don't make trouble for yourself cuz trouble will find you if you you know if you allow it to and so his life eops is just like live as well everyone as you can so I C my dad passed it on to me so I say connection because relationships has been key every transition I've either had internally in that organization or externally I look back there think there's only one job I've apply for of all the companies I've work the rest just come through some sort of connection and I probably underestimated that until you know just reflected more recently connection and then um with that connection being very deliberate about that um I have cadences like people do it their sale you with sales and I'm going to follow up I've got a lead a prospect I Prospect and I manage and nurture my stakeholder relationship try to so that you know I I was on a call earlier on today group of us who knew each other from the UK went spoken in a while put it on the calendar I said all right guys we're going to meet again in about four to six weeks and I'm very deliberate about that because Time Slips by um as much as we have social media and all these other things there's nothing like this um I was tell my wife the other day about um you know we were going to be doing this yeah met him through through dff Jarvis and you know that we had that connection I think you you in town and we met you know that those things that have been very near and dear to me and I've been tried to be very deliberate about that um there a few of the things well okay I want to put a pin on pin in that because I want to I want to come back to that but you said you mentioned something before because I think that that's hugely important and I want to expand on that you you mentioned something before about your ability to find like what where where the the challeng is the problem and then do a Sprint through it then you you have a innate ability you have a knack for being able to discern things quickly and do that uh where where where do you see that like emerge like like how in your life do you see that not just work but in life of like we got to take care of this this is a challenge this is important we need to do that can you elaborate on that I I just I just want to hear more about that because that I think that's very important because a lot of times people will let things linger or just go pass but being able to discern those things and work through them is so crucial yeah that's a great um start to see that pretty early on some of it I think quite Naturally by what I was exposed to kind of growing up um growing up is sort of an inner city environment you have to be quite resourceful um you have to think fast than your feet so you know some of the anyone's kind of watch you know listened into this you think you know kind of what's Urban um London lifestyle like on on the on the bad side go watch top white on Netflix Pretty violent but you know it kind of gives you a good picture I wasn't one of those guys but I could be in and around them and you picked up you know a number of things around this is how you think Bast on your feet this is how you think you know when you're in a particular situation and um so some of it was a bit survival the other piece of it was um I just watched our very large extended family despite whatever we were faced with be able to kind of push through problems and get things resolved come together you know it's a very much of a community lifestyle and then I fast forward about middle and high school and this kind of speaks to some of the leadership piece was um and it happened in sports so we would have these intergrade tournaments whether it be soccer basketball uh track Cricket rug be um I was I was an allrounder when it came to sports but I was not an Allstar by Stretch can hold my own um but I wasn't I wasn't the best player you know probably wasn't even top 10 or top five but one of the things that I noticed this pattern start to emerge is every we had one of those tournaments across some different sports I'd raise my hand to like hey you know they rotate the captain every year all right anytime you know I was Captain we would win and what I what and it wasn't because we were the best team on in the grade I just s to have this neack hey I need you to play over here and I know you want to play up top you're really good you'll be really good out here on the right watch you being able to gauge people and say think this is the play and being able to put a Playbook together so I started to see very early see patterns I could see themes and and then bringing people into that kind of way of thinking and kind of you know saying look this is what I think let's try thisen if it doesn't work pivot um and that's s carried forward in terms of studies carried forward into places where I worked as well and um I just thought everybody could do that until um more recently kind of in the last few years at work some of the you know people I posted about they know what's your role um and something that's very hard to describe because I pride myself on just being you know being able to see things from multiple perspectives able to put my shoes in this my feet my you know my feet in the shoes of the stakeholder and I'm I'm team jlll like how how does jlll how does jl's client get the best outcome from here put ego to the side and bring others into the equation and just yeah but I'm able just it's this thing to able to see the pattern and uh jop those down and then and then use that history and those data points to help me with the next one so usually I've got something playing I've seen this before I've seen something similar why don't we start here well you know what I'll give you a little back story on why why I think this is so amazing to me to hear you say that because we've been on calls and you know group calls video you know zooms and we've met we've met in person and we've you're smart engaging guy you know you got you got all the tools and it's great like I was like oh man I really like I really like see you know we got along it it wasn't oh of course uh but it wasn't until you led that bcen call where I saw all your talents on full display May Maybe not maybe not all very I don't want to limit you to that but it was like you know you've always been you know a present in the meetings and every and all the calls and all the times you spent together but it was when you had the opportunity to lead when when you were given the stage it was like oh there he is it was it was it was amazing to see how you were so organized you were so deliberate you were so oh the the Cadence the pace the everything the followup and I had never seen that in on full display until then so you saying that makes perfect sense and that he does I mean it was really impressive to to see that and one of the things that I I would like to hear I would like to hear your opinion on this is like I can only imagine and put my own shoes my feet in these shoes right like being consider yourself a leader but not necessarily being there in your career yet and not being in a leadership position but still finding yourself leading in different ways um do you feel like you've broken some kind of ceiling recently in your own understanding of who you are and what you bring to the table and an understanding of what you can do and people are recognizing that now like has there been a specific time or place that you've had this Awakening if you will i' have and I would say you're absolutely right it's been in the last definitely the last couple of years one of the things that thankfully has helped me especially both internally and externally is having sponsors so I've had a couple of sponsors here internally at very senior levels of jll for for for a few different reasons who have just you know given me stage and opportunity to go try something so um my current leader I work for his predecessor kind of tapped me up very early late 2021 early 2022 I says Hey Ste I've got this thing I'm trying to figure out trying to reboot something that we're doing globally um can you take a look at this for me he hadn't worked to me before he heard some good things but he gave me enough Runway um to say hey this kind of how I want it to go kind of took it ran with it and came back to him and he's like oh this is much further along than I thought and he's kind of gave me more Runway fast forward within a two three months I was pretty much working for him fulltime then set up kind of gave me this one it gave me this exposure more than what I'd had prior um which I've had some good exposure opened up the exposure and then actually me not realizing at the time that you know at some point he was going to transition and now work for his successor in an even more expanded capacity so there was this realization that opportunity met kind of support to try and and and even fail in a couple of areas or get some guidance and coaching on some things so that that definitely started to happen and um to your point about getting clearer about value I spent a lot of time in the last couple of years inventory in like what I'm good at I have a mentor who told me that every quarter told me back in 2020 um he said start writing down every quarter like your accomplishments and what you want to do next like just so like it was so because you're going to have a year end of viw you're going to look back you don't want to be scrambling in December trying to figure out what have I accomplished all year so I've got into this Cadence and that's you know just inventory in what I've done what I enjoyed what I learned um and so I start to get some anchors around kind of who I am and what I bring my you know my ability to connect my ability to catalyze things my ability to create um synthesize complex problems and then bring other people into it how to Def that level the stakeholder playing field um in a way that respects everyone's position and respects everyone's realm of responsibility but I try and coming very frictionless again it's I wear jll Jersey or if I'm working with someone outside of jll you know some other little projects I do hey I'm I'm part of your group part of your team we're going to get this done but there there has been that realization and that's been really important and I think we all go through that we we make transitions we make pivots being able to get just a little bit clear on what what I have to offer who I am what I bring to the table what do I stand for they sound really like straightforward things to to know but um for those for me they look evolved over time um and so I've kind of been you know kind of wrapping my head around this getting much more coordinated and aligned internally and that's what's enabled me to be a bit extraordinary things that you saw that day probably would have been a could do that um but that to that's taken practice you know practicing facilitating getting feedback practicing um being in those situations and asking people like you know how did that go is there any way I can do that different um and better and so by taking inventory are there any things that you do in your practice whether it's you know we we spoken before about about going for walks and you mentioned writing things down is there a specific uh schedule you we use the word Cadence like that that you that you're journaling that you're meditating that you're walking that you're doing these things is there specific things that you do so there there have specific cadences and then places where I find it easier to do it um to often time I just find it easier to inventory and reflect on that when I'm not like sat at a desk be on a walk during my drive sometimes it comes I'm a movie buff so sometimes I'm watching a movie and I'm seeing themes so what what more recently I'll do a couple of things I'll do impromptu and I'll just use the recorder you know I've got a a I'll just I'll record it in there get it to transcribe so I've got both the recording and the transcription and one of the things I found quite really powerful is hereas writing it down and journ like do but hearing it in your own voice is very powerful as well and I did I underestimated the power of hearing myself affirm myself and speak well of myself or what I've enjoying or what I'm passionate about hearing me playing it back in my own voice has been like life changing so what what is what's this app that you use for this. a yeah there are a few of them out there but people often use it in these video calls and it it records and then it transes I I use it to um just to journal capture my thoughts and then I Al I also do written journaling that's that's not daily that tends to be more kind of every two to three days that's a lot of gratitude processing difficult problems but in terms of that Clarity on who I am what I'm experiencing what I'm enjoying a lot of that I'm doing by voice H all right cuz this is tools talent and techniques so you it's a technique and and the tool that you just mentioned so way to check I would for those who are comfortable would encourage just try a few times just um if you know don't if you're Android this I don't know what app that is because I'm I'm team team iOS but on the app just use the the voice note and uh just capture yourself a short voice note um the other thing I do I've got a couple of groups that I have like on WhatsApp some people use the mro polo app but I use WhatsApp quite a bit and a few guys that I just chop it up with and U we might be going through a book or we might be you know going through a particular seasonal thing and this this is quite recent but we're very deliberate about um sharing our thoughts via video so it's not te just texting them in get on the video no more than two minutes getting us to you know into a Cadence of sharing our thoughts sharing what we're learning sharing we're gleaning bouncing off each other you can respond back to someone's initial post by you know a text message I share that because there's also some power in doing that in a community of like-minded people that don't you don't to be the same gender don't to share the same world view but being able to share some of that learning with people who are likeminded who want to progress want to grow takes a lot a bit of vulnerability to do that but you start to forge connections and out of that you start learning more about each other and that's where you start to see opportunities even partner together and things and work together as well so those those are some of the the the other cadences had to put that key the point I'm making is not doing it by yourself yeah in that community and bringing the connections and and meaningful deliver connections yeah so let me go back to the like what your your day job and you know working at jll and what you're seeing is there anything that stands out that you're seeing as I guess not like a trend but a theme um that you see like where where this commercial real estate is going or where things are headed and what what are you seeing right now in your day-to-day so um you know not withstanding where at least did the US were a few weeks away from you I think we we said the last two three elections have been the biggest one but I think again this one was you know been that seemingly quite close I think that's a that's going to be pivotal but that that kind of a ju to pose next to what we're seeing with the acceleration technology data the AI piece um many people have said it I'm I'm on the same train which is there are things that I do and that our teams are doing that have done in on the day-to-day in terms of synthesizing data getting certain business processes process that um AI capabilities are able to leak from and accelerate some of that ability to integrate systems meet clients where they are so I think that technology Evolution and acceleration we're seeing I think the other thing if you is what clients want and client decision making and buyer Behavior it's not what it was sort of 5 years ago um yes there's some things are still very staple about the industry but you know most either if your investor or an occupier a client or your owner and you property you want people want us to help them see around the corner um and and be an adviser be a partner which we know which is intuitive to us especially in our Capital markets or at leas in business with Even in our all our work Dynamics is is highly transactional um the buyer doesn't want a transactional engagement they want a partner and they're consolidating providers so you know especially on some of the larger accounts they'll chop it up between us and our competitors and some of them are trying to consolidate some of that now um so they're looking for a partner who can do full life cycle Services which we all the you know the big three four of us could do that but they want they want that done in a way that's that's novel that's intentional it's deliberate um not just in it for the deal but you're you're going to help me win um and then uh I would say bridg to kind of me coming into the industry I think um the Personnel profile is AOL it so I remember I'm going to be candid I remember coming like my first first few months working here at jllr hadn't done been exposed to commercial real estate At All by that point you know I was I had just come College I was like good 18 years kind of into my career um and I remember going to this buch with a senior leader here and I was sitting down at this table and I didn't know what anybody was talking about and I was like this is a secret society I did not know existed yeah and the and this level of connection of this person knew who this person like they were talk about who they knew fromall game this person's god daughter was and I was like goodness me what like this this is wild this is different I I'm debrief him with another Gentleman on the drive back to the office hey help me understand this share all that to say there's still aspects of the industry you know like many others that people grow into an industry they grow within an industry it's quite you know that their circles are aware of it but I I've seen a lot more Junior talent coming and you guys have been work you know through the the bcen um just a different profile of talent uh both midc career and early career and even some of our more senior hires you know our our ex who runs our UK business from AIS perspective and she's been running imia she was she was from outside the industry she joined us maybe in the last few years as that's another Trend I'm seeing just an infusion of non-traditional commercial real estate talent and for some it works really well for some it's organ rejection because culture as well but I'm seeing more of that and I think that's going to become even more important for our clients as well and just try to figure out really complex problems as you letar Tech sustainability um just what's happening with with rates and things like that just having different Minds those who know the industry know the players who got the connections but others those of us who think about problem a little differently and some other experience think another one of our Executives came from you know from another consumer goods and is now running uh our PDS business as well as some of our our other parts our client grow business as well yeah there there's so many complex challenges not all just in the world right but um in commercial real estate and how that reflects and so you know they're going to take unique unique challenges are going to call for Unique answers and solutions and and I I feel like that's one of those things that that I saw in your ability to do that to take these complex problems and and really boil it down and pull out what are those major aspects that you need to focus on or what are those what are those key points that you can you can go the furthest with by by solving them so yeah that that's yeah it's funny I'll give you a um it's funny some B here I use this to in in in meetings some I don't always use these words but you know these three eyes and they're not mine I got that this someone else's framework you know going in like since we last get strategic alignment what issues are there um what new insights do we have what ideas do you have and use it to those three eyes like issue you know problems bottlenecks mistakes what we observing what new insights what new information do we have what's happened since we last met uh what happened on this particular account this client or with that particular project and giving people a chance to share new ideas like what what we do going forward and and infusing that into discussions and so what you what I was not over about is even using some of that that Forum that you saw me facilitate is kind of ahead of time I drawing insights and trying to understand the issues and ideas and you bring that into kind of a main discussion give everybody a voice but at the same time trying to leave people down apart right what's doable what's what's achievable but then during that you know part of my job is also to stretch the thinking I was like are we sure this is where we want to be could it be more than this tell me more about that so what start to happen in that meeting you start you all start I watched you all sudden this could be more than what it's been to this point you start to re-energize folks and then offline take their assignments and they start to drive those focus in on those and things like that as well so I I've read something recently about uh I believe it was it was Jeff Bezos and the how he holds meetings and he always speaks last I believe it was Jeff visel I'm pretty sure it is but he always speaks last because he doesn't want to be the one because if he says something then other people don't want to go against it or whatever so like there's there's a there's a technique there is there anything that you use and when you're facilitating these discussions or you're you're doing it is there anything that jumps out further than than what you already pointed out that you're like this is a framework that I've used whether you got it from somewhere else so like what what are some other things that that you find so um I love you mentioned listening and this is not even just someone who does what I do but if you're team lead or you're you know you run an ACC team or you a client or you're working with your client the listening piece is it's it's really key we I kind of grew up in an era where um you know especially you're coming out you know College University kind of and and in Consulting was like you made a name for yourself if you had a signature voice and you you know you you you had you you had the player you had the you had the best PowerPoint you you and you start you know move move through the ranks and so that was Al Al also synonymous person who had our best thing to say or the most to say and actually that's not always true and so one of the things the the art of listening is key because as a leader or a uh you know or anyone on a team doesn't have to be a leader your ability to kind of use that time to kind of do a 360 on kind of what's going on capture your notes and kind of start to see the threads is really key one of the things I do again this is not mine but um i' ask four questions um you know what is take where we are right now given the particular issue what's right you know r i g HT just I think I did that with you guys on the prep what's wrong what's missing and what's confusing you start to emerge what that helps you do is like what do we need to keep doing what might we need to eliminate what do we need to clarify what do we need to add as and that that it for question piece it just gets the group talking it gets stakeholders engaging and Thinking Beyond the thing that's right immediately you know they can thinkig about things immediately in front of them they can also detach from it a little bit and make it a little more objective be very fact based um so I try to do that or or things like that and um often time as well I've actually become much more power point like um I just because that what we're doing now there's no SL we just engaging oneon-one there's a place for slides basos is the same he he likes this memo thing um as well I'm not sure if he's I think you know that was something he implemented Amazon he said I don't want slides we're going to send going to have like this five to six page memo there pros and cons of that as well um but the reason I say that is one of the things I try do is throw out a notion on concept and especially when there's a lot more virtual meetings get people talking and engaging and not fixated on what you've got on the screen I think those jobs was great the lake Steve Jobs great his visuals are amazing I Tex some of my cues from him he's like very impactful but it really in his narrative and his ability to communicate um and I think behind the scenes he was doing a lot of listening as well but that's that's a that's a really important technique I've grown into again the last couple of years and more so in this this current role because there are so many voices and opinions and it's a very Dynamic landscape that rol Global so I try and spend spend as much time I do listening and I do communica and actually more so um kind of train myself to listen more and a bit like Bas I'll speak less not always last but I I'll try and speak less and that's not because I don't have lots to say I'm always talking and I'm not listening and that that's me and I got that feedback as well when you mentioned those four questions the you know what's what's wrong what's not you know you asked those four if you were to just in in the in the conversations that you have and the meetings you facilitate which of those four quadrants seems to be the most engaging like like do do you feel like certain teams like and it maybe it's situational but is there one like everybody like focuses too much on what's right and not enough on what's wrong or is there anything that really jumps out to you yes a lot of people gravitate to typically what's wrong you know they it's kind of usually not always top of mind but it's a very black and white question what's wrong we don't have this we don't have enough budget we can't do this we can't do that so that one usually gets kind people usually have a longer list there unless some I find that a bit harder because I'm more of a glass heartful person so I I gravitate more to what's right the one where you get a ton of Engagement and has some really interesting discussion is around what's confus it and that's because you confusion is about you know typically what you need to do is bring Clarity and it can be really hard in this environment um things move so quickly the problems are complex some things are quite straightforward to Sol um that's where you could have some really interesting dialogue around bringing Clarity um to things that are confus or having a dialogue around what is it we need to make clearer Clarity enables you to accelerate um in a number of different ways um and the challenges now in this very kind of volatile environment and very kind of complex Dynamic environment clarity lasts for a moment um at least on the surface of things and you you often got to move the lack of clarity um clear Clarity but you do have to have conviction um you know I'd imagine and just hearing you work through that and I'm processing this myself I'd imagine that dialogue that comes from what's confusing is that through that there could be some things that are right but they you were just confused or they could be wrong but you didn't realize that they were wrong because you were confused and that tend to open up these other conversations those other quadrants it does and um it often um helps you see another Advantage but for example I hold this up like hold this what do you see uh you were holding up a Fiji water bottle you see Fiji so you see the words Fiji what else do you see on the front of the ball uh flower flower see I tell you what I see I see a barcode earth spinus water a bunch of small print with minerals something about Electro it's the same bottle you see this I see that and sometimes all you need to do in a meeting like that is you're just allowing people to see now I see what you saw you're seeing what I'm seeing and so um it's a seeing things from all sides I was I was explaining this to one of my sons recently it's an old movie I think was called vantage point I said it was the same thing that happened and everyone told that story from a few different Vantage points and a lot of the time as you said the ability as a team leader as as a business leader as client lead to be able to just have that dexterity to see things from a few different sides it doesn't mean you have to agree with everything getting that 360 view just allows you to make a decision with a bit more confidence hopefully what's what are things let's use uh I'm not going to use all four quadrants but let's like what what are you or let's change it up a little bit what are you most excited about in your in your life whether whether it's it's business whether it's life like what what are you looking forward to and we're recording this uh early October 2024 yes and uh the US election is coming up in a few weeks I we'll probably release this podcast in mid October but all right that that being said uh I want to give people a frame of reference for when we're having this conversation yes that's good so I'll lead with some it was a couple of Elections back um and um you know there was an outcome and I'm the next day saying that you know different opinion and what what was what was good about it what wasn't and I said look we need leadership at all levels of society right the family marriages schools we need all the way up to the White House so yes understood there's we will have a preference as who sits in that seat here's the reality we need leadership all levels so I I start with that and what I'm most excited about and I think maybe we touched on it earlier on is this this notion I'm I'm most excited about um working on Mission what I mean by that is I as I used that Avenger analogy earlier is that with the The Avengers what I love about them is uh you know they each one of them on their own it's an amazing skill set depth superpowers it's it's fictional I think each one of us in our own right is our is an Avenger we have gifts and talents and things like that the key with them is that um you know their problems bigger than that one Avenger can solve on their own so Mission brings them together and so I'm most excited in this season of My Life the world where we are there are things bigger than us that no one group or no one organization consult I see the day where like you know we have to we going to solve a client's problem jointly with one of our competitors like that's that's missional based yes we'll try to make money we've got shareholders of but that's that's what the world needs people who come together on making the world it sounds it sounds esoteric B that is exactly what I'm most excited about and I'm seeing it happen around me lots of little way I saw it happen with you guys um you and Derek 2020 Mission brought you guys together Mission you know and some of your entrepreneurial Endeavors um so that as a Capstone um just using the Avenger Avengers everywhere just um coming together on Mission in different Industries different parts of society um I was in a school district meeting earlier on we was talking about real big opportunities with parents and PE decision makers from all different parts of life we brought all our perspectives together um the school district on their own would have been able to come up with some those Solutions I learn things about how they make decisions that will make me a better parent um in terms of how I engage and that appreciate what what Educators and and the educational district is doing for our children and our students um so that's what that's what I'm most excited about I think there's tons of opportunity um and I'm at a stage in life where I'm just like just go after it um um put it out there go after it um that's where I am on it I hopefully that that resonates that makes sense and it makes perfect sense and um you know again like I touched on before to see you and what you do and how you do it in in these meetings and and I feel like I have a front row seat to to watch you come into your own and maybe maybe before I met you you were already like on on your path and doing that but it's it's been really impressive to see and I'm excited to see you continue to evolve and and make your imprint make your uh make your Avenger um contribution to the mission absolutely I appreciate and that that meeting was a moment for you guys and it was for me as well you know I was very willing I I was it was exciting I believed in it but um we have those moments we all do in life we're like you're working on something participating in something and it just unlocks something something you like hey I really that really meant something to me and um it helps you find one of the things I'll call that is just finding your signature in the world and um and that has two Dimensions your voice and your contribution for others also you know being able to demonstrate be distinct within yourself and be very clear on who you are what you stand for when you can do both of those together you know you get you find your signature yeah and and that signature I think that's a great point and one of the things I really enjoy about this podcast is one I enjoy having these conversations with people that I that I admire that I respect and I we get to share some of this with the world at whatever level stage it is again I'm no oprra I'm no I'm no Joan but the thing is like what we have we have these moments and it's like I enjoy doing this and I'm going to keep doing it because I enjoy it and hopefully the people that that are listening that are participating enjoy it as well but now that I know what that feel feels like I know that experience you mentioned the other entrepreneurial Endeavors like the the glasses the ranges project that I'm working on I like it's the most amazing thing that I've ever done like I love it I just can't stop thinking about it and um the people that I'm meeting along the way but now that I know what that feels like there's no there's no turning back yeah like I I will I will be doing this type of stuff for the rest of my life till till my heart stops beating you know like so finding that signature whatever that is and again it's it's not ever you know exact no but there's a there's an Essence there that I'm I'm tapped into and I love it love it I'm happy for you yeah as I've watched you do that I mean I'm like amazing just so forward thinking so novel so determined so differentiated um and it's inspiring um and it's motivating as well and the thing as you said you know what now you've experience it's like once you know you can't unknow either right yeah yeah well thank you I really appreciate you saying that because it's not it's not always rainbow and sunshine it's hard too but it's worth it it's so worth it amazing all right well hey Steph thank you so much um so one last thing is there anything you want to share like any uh how to contact you to follow you on your socials anything you want to put out there um the best place is where I'm I am most is on is on LinkedIn um so you know you put the link somewhere you know just po reach me there and then um standing by for coming soon going into the new year folks chat me there I have some I going to start putting some stuff out a bit more you've noticed I've been kind of posted a bit more but video content coming through and some other things as we round out the year and then going into 2025 my my catch phras is like all right CL going live in 25 all right I love it man well listen if there's anything I can do to support you or or help along the journey you got it anything you day Dustin all right thank you Stephen [Music]